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Eruner In reply to 13-Nyx [2011-07-09 20:03:04 +0000 UTC]

let me explain: Breath of life costs 3W for permanent return of creature to battlafield.
Hero Spirit brings back creature only for 3 turns (vanishing 3) and its multicolor (from Arquenia WRU, red manna returns creature for temporal attack, white manna returns creature as "resurection" for defense, and illusions are blue usually).
Thats why it costs 1RW.
And Illusion because this is not Kamigawa and because there are more Illusion cads in Arquenia than Spirits in whole Amyla (5 multycolor shards like Alara).

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13-Nyx In reply to Eruner [2011-07-10 04:43:14 +0000 UTC]

Kamigawa is not the only plane where spirits exists, Ravnica is an example, the dominarian spirits.

I ask for red because I would like to see it more than just a fix in the mana curve. But it's just my opinion.

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nablon In reply to PlayfulElegy [2011-07-08 12:34:37 +0000 UTC]

why should it at least cost 5? I don't get it. Breath of life costs just one color and just puts it into play. This one has an additional color you need to pay, plus the creature lives for only 3 turns.
The only thing I would want to see changed, is the fact that this one is common. It should be uncommon in my opinion.

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Eruner In reply to nablon [2011-07-09 20:18:45 +0000 UTC]

its common because Arquenia is full of magic, and such sorcery is nothing new under sun. Spells are strong, but creatures are fragile.

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nablon In reply to Eruner [2011-07-10 11:43:09 +0000 UTC]

aha thanks for the explanation.
It would be a good idea if you put that in the description, so that we all know why you made it cost so little

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PlayfulElegy In reply to nablon [2011-07-09 01:14:15 +0000 UTC]

Now then, this is where you get a lesson in MtG history.

Blue had prodigal sorcerer, a card with the ability to ping. Note that breath of life came around at this time.

Back int he day, magic didn't have conditions set onto what effects go on specific colors. This was later revised and played with around the time spiral block.

One of the most significant things to note is that Ressurrecting creatures with sorceries and enchantments was placed solidly into black's domain. White would still get the occasional card capable of reviving creatures specifically, but this was limited to high cmc angels, or to them being low cmc creatures (sun titan). The only card that significantly broke this rule recently was Marshal's Anthem, but it does so due to it's flavor (and the fact that it's you paying 3WWW for the effect to start).


Now then, cards that use effects outside of color are allowed to exist due to flavor, but their effects are usually weakened in order to counterbalance the fact that it's out of color (which represents the difficulty that color has in using those abilities). This is the reason that the card needs a cmc of 4-5, as that equivocates to the current power level of Rise From the Grave, the current black revival card.

I could also note that the creation of illusions is usually limited to blue, but in this case, the flavor of the card allows for it to be white.


Again, do a little more study into design before you go putting your two cents into design philosophy.

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Eruner In reply to PlayfulElegy [2011-07-09 20:16:31 +0000 UTC]

dont talk about MtG history without knowing Amyla history (in which Im working on, but some informations you can find on my profile).
And Arquenia (WRU shard of Amyla) is a world of strong magic and very powerful wizards/mages. And they are already able to ressurect somebody, but only for temporal time now, but Im sure they will improve.

And let me explain this:
Breath of life costs 3W for permanent return of creature to battlafield.
Hero Spirit brings back creature only for 3 turns (vanishing 3) and its multicolor (from Arquenia WRU, red manna returns creature for temporal attack, white manna returns creature as "resurection" for defense, and illusions are blue usually).
Thats why it costs 1RW.
And Illusion because this is not Kamigawa and because there are more Illusion cads in Arquenia than Spirits in whole Amyla.

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PlayfulElegy In reply to Eruner [2011-07-10 06:59:00 +0000 UTC]

I was referring to color theory when taking about that. Card effects happening out of their parent colors usually cost more, the only exception being in time spiral where the wheel rotated.

Well, spirits are not limited to kamigawa (Howling banshee is a good example of a non kamigawa spirit, or the tortured soul that was just printed) and illusions are usually limited to blue. The other thing to note is that even in it's parent color, black, ressurection doesn't fall below 5 unless conditions are involved recently. (Turn 3 Iona will be lethal with little issue).

Breath of life is not a good example for resurrection abilities, as this was before the color pie was set. (Should also note that at the same time black had 2 mana resurrection abilities back then.)

Not knocking the card itself, but it's generally considered that following color pie and rules should take precedence over flavor.

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Eruner In reply to PlayfulElegy [2011-07-10 18:50:33 +0000 UTC]

Im using color theory a lot, because make a good multicolor block isnt piece of cake. And also I have to make rule text which (perfectly) fits with picture, flavor text too (sometimes).
I use color theory a lot, because Amyla shards are 3-colored, and also they have some specific atributes/rules/mechanics.

This card isnt black, because its supposed to be played in Arquenia (WRU) and Minerion (WBR) shards.
But maybe mono-white would be better, because Haxar (BGW) uses graveyard a lot, but Im sure to not add black manna to the card this time, because I would rework whole card and remove it from Arquenia

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PlayfulElegy In reply to Eruner [2011-07-11 00:14:53 +0000 UTC]

No, I wasn't saying make the card black, I was saying up the CMC to compensate for the fact that white does not resurrect as easily as black does, and for the cat that no card recently has had the ability to bring any creature back while remaining below 5 cmc (mostly due to the fact that it would give reanimator more feul in vintage/legacy). (Other thing to note is that it might be better if the card bets exiled after leaving the field, both flavorwise and so people can't just spam the same creature with 4 copies of the card.)

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nablon In reply to PlayfulElegy [2011-07-09 15:34:08 +0000 UTC]

I really get what you're trying to say, but still, the creature is only in play for about 3 turns, which should reduce the cost of the spell.
I have a little knowledge of MtG too, you know? Played if for a fair amount of years..
I know that black has a lot of spells that return your creatures from the graveyard to play, but so does white. Think of Miraculous Recovery(I know, this is an old one..) and Pulsemage Advocate. I have that last one myself. And although it has a drawback (giving back 3 cards in a graveyard to your opponent), it instantly revives a creature just by tapping him, and only costs 3.

Also, never suggested that the card should have (or keep) these collors, and I agree that the card should be B/W, B/U or W/U (considering the illusion type).

It hurts me to see that you think I don't know anything about collors and the abilities that belong to them. I'm very well aware that the card could've been black.

Just saying you'd like to see it black would've been sufficient...

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PlayfulElegy In reply to nablon [2011-07-10 07:05:30 +0000 UTC]

3 turns of Iona is lethal, 3 turns of a titan or preator gives insane advantage, which is why wotc has stopped putting in ressurection cards at that low of a CMC.

Not MtG in general, but design philosophy, which is an entirel different category.

Again, you have to think post ravnica, or at least post mirrodin. Anything before that doesn't follow strictly by the magic color pie used in modern design philosophy.


THing is I'm not sating you don't know anyhting about magic, I'm referring to design philosophy, which most magic players don't read up on unless they're absolutely serious about building possible sets.


Also, black isn't necessary due to flavor, though mechanically, the card does need the extra expense to compensate for this.

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Eruner In reply to Zanshlou [2011-07-09 20:29:11 +0000 UTC]

thx, I spend more time on making the first ability correctly, the second has been written from my memory, I thought I was correct.
now fixed

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nablon In reply to Zanshlou [2011-07-08 12:31:29 +0000 UTC]

you're right, that's how it's supposed to be

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Zanshlou In reply to nablon [2011-07-08 19:09:15 +0000 UTC]

I find I have this problem with most every custom card I see. I used to play way too much of the game and have made so many customs myself that I'm a "wording nazi" so to speak. XD

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nablon In reply to Zanshlou [2011-07-09 15:12:16 +0000 UTC]

hahaha I see no problem in that. It's just that most of us are not from the UK or USA, so we don't speak English that well Some of our contributors are really bad at spelling and grammar, but I try to see through that
It's not that big a problem for me if you try and help improve the wording in cards. On the contrary! I really appreciate it

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Zanshlou In reply to nablon [2011-07-09 17:09:37 +0000 UTC]

I would suggest to most people to go to the gatherer and look up the kind of ability you want and try to find examples of how they actually word it to generally better custom card quality. I would do that but I'm lazy and usually don't think of suggesting it...

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nablon In reply to Zanshlou [2011-07-09 18:13:46 +0000 UTC]

hahaha
I usually check my own cards for wording if I don't know for sure

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