Comments: 23
SPEARHARD [2022-10-05 23:27:59 +0000 UTC]
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PeterGlade [2022-03-12 18:45:51 +0000 UTC]
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Orphydian [2021-01-29 14:54:52 +0000 UTC]
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tomgrab100 [2020-03-08 10:27:52 +0000 UTC]
Landsknecht with sword is so awesome, great work!
Greetings
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UrbanFrolof [2020-01-10 00:32:04 +0000 UTC]
An average day in the Empire
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Trelock [2020-01-08 23:58:01 +0000 UTC]
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topragim68 [2020-01-08 16:54:33 +0000 UTC]
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C05M0NAUT In reply to Gabbanoche [2020-01-08 16:53:11 +0000 UTC]
Hey hey, mind pointing out any? I’m a bit curious to know what I’ve missed.
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Gabbanoche In reply to C05M0NAUT [2020-01-08 22:11:40 +0000 UTC]
Allright.
The execution took place on Stortorget (the grand square), although I'm not quite sure how it looked back then I would still imagen there was houses blocking the view of the castle (this is however not depicted on the Blodbadstavlan which I guess is the main inspiration for this piece).
Iirc the executions took place upon a platform so all of Stockholm could see the "traitors". The executions was made by an executioner (They even brought in two) and not a soldier with a zweihänder.
Two bishops were executed before the nobility and common people.
The nobleman being brought forth is dressed in 1630s fashion. I don't think the burgonet would been seen in the 1520's its mostly a latter half of the 1500s helmet afaik. And lastly (this is just me being nitpicky af) there should be more beards and/or moustaches).
Still a work of art ofcourse!
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C05M0NAUT In reply to Gabbanoche [2020-01-13 23:14:46 +0000 UTC]
Ah I see! For some reason I assumed you were referring mostly to the clothing worn in the image. Regardless, thanks for the information! Don't think I've ever heard about this event before.
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ManuelKrommenacker In reply to Gabbanoche [2020-01-09 01:19:13 +0000 UTC]
The place depicted is indeed Stortorget, although the whole illustration is basically cut in two different views that doesn't link directly to each other. The first down half is what you'd see on the square, and the far city view is just a far view based on historical depictions of the time.
You're right about the platform, but the editor wanted the illustration to look like the 'traditional' depictions of the event made during the 16th century, with the bishop's mitre cap on, while in facts I doubt the clerics or nobles were allowed to keep their costumes and emblems for the execution, moreover because they were considered heretics and traitors. But these things were requested anyways.
They wanted the illustration based on these kind of images:
se-hi-ms-cdn.clio.me/stockholm…
There, the executioner is depicted as on of the landsknechte. The Danish troops in Sweden at the time and during the revolt after were german mercenaries, including the famous Schwarze Garde, that I featured here. What makes me doubt that the exectioners were locals, is the fact that executioner's swordq are more a 17th century thing, and don't appear archeologicaly or in sources before that time. Meanwhile landsknechte regiments are depicted and documented to practice executions by two handed swords since the early 16th century.
c8.alamy.com/compfr/cnrnfk/eve…
www.akg-images.fr/Docs/AKG/Med…
Or this one from the Bundschue uprising:
l450v.alamy.com/450vfr/fgpmpw/…
Now I'm not sure about Sweden or Denmark but executions by sword in the early 16th century in germanic areas seem to be something rather specific to german military/landsknecht tradition, the regiment forming a square around and the culprits beheaded in the center. If you have actual sources stating that the executioners were Swedes using swords please let me know!
You're right about the nobleman outfit, this kind of doublet is more something of the late 16th, early 17th century.
About the helmets, those depicted are not burgonets. These are early german Sturmhauben in different variations. The one resembling a later Burgonet was in use among german infantry at least since Maximilian's reign, who died in 1519. You can check Osprey's Men-at-Arms on the landsknechte, there's a photograph of different german half armours and sturmhauben from that time. The burgonet, crested burgonet, then closed burgonet, is most likely an evolution from the german sturmhaube.
Let me knwo if you have sources about the executioners, I'm curious about this!
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Gabbanoche In reply to ManuelKrommenacker [2020-01-09 14:32:52 +0000 UTC]
Yes, the 'traditional' depictions you mention are here in Sweden known as the Bloodbath poster, it was ordered in 1524 by Gustaf I (Wasa).
And I agree with you about them probably not being dressed in church attier, I assume its there for the view to easy identify them as bishops. Which was good of you to keep for that exact same purpose, I must say (it also adds to the drama tbh).
Indeed it shows only landsknechts soldier committing the atrocities, but then again its a propaganda piece so makes sense it showing foreign mercs committed the foul deeds.
I have no specific source to link you, I'm afraid, since what I've read about it is in book form and in Swedish.
But in the sources I've read they always state that the executions was made by two executioners (their ethnicity I dont know, but they could very well be the local swedish ones, since Christian was also king of Sweden). The bishops and nobility was executed by sword as was custom. The Mayor, magistrates, servants and various henchmen where hanged.
Edit: I actually see on wikipedia that they credit the executions to a German officer called Jörgen Homuth, so maybe you werent wrong after all(still pretty sure there was two of them)!
My personal opinion about the 'soldiers square' style of execution is that it would in this instance make the people of stockholm unable to see the horror that happens to traitors. The 'soldiers square' to me feels more lika military thing.
You're absolutely right about the Sturmhaube and Burgonette, my bad.
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